OZ ATV :: The Australian ATV Forum

[flipper]

Things are certainly changing fast... Many of you have probably participated in ADBA (Australian Dirt Bike Adventures) rides which are usually held in the NNSW towns of Urbenville & Woodenbong. These rides are primarily on private land and State Forest.

For some time the eligibility for the ride was full road rego (or more commonly conditional rego). Most riders for these events come from QLD.

At the Urbenville ride last weekend, NSW Police attended and advised that they intended to charge any rider that used a bike (or quad) that didn't have lights, indicators or who broke the "speed limit" in State Forests of 60kmh.

Ray Buchanan is a great guy and through negotiation seemed to get the police officers (apparently from the Lismore trail bike squad) to acknowledge that conditional registration didn't require indicators etc.

I think the writing is on the wall... It seems that even for well organised events with strong pro family & common sense rules that the bureaucracy is trying to shut down all such forms of trail bike & quad bike riding.

Interesting times ahead.

[can-am 800rxmr]

So can you guys please clarify this for me before I spend $18,000+ of my hard earned cash on a new Quad. Is there Anywhere I can Legally ride one around Townsville or am I wasting my money???. Thanks
_________________
Anthony Cooper
2012 Can-am 800 R X MR

[Dino]

can-am 800rxmr wrote:

So can you guys please clarify this for me before I spend $18,000+ of my hard earned cash on a new Quad. Is there Anywhere I can Legally ride one around Townsville or am I wasting my money???. Thanks

You can legally ride it on private property.
All vehicles ridden on public land are, legally speaking, to be registered and ridden by licensed riders. A car license is a required minimum.

As quads and Side by sides do not fall under Australian Design Rules, and never will, TMR ( or the old Dept of Transport ) have available conditional registration, which is the same as offered to slashers, bobcats and backhoes. This means conditions are attatched such as written permision is required for use. And that is where the entire system starts to fail.

It is so complicated and useless that many people opt to ride without any rego. With a estimated 200 thousand plus quads in Qld, and less than 3000 registered, it is pretty obvious current policies encourage illegal use.

And that is why we are petitioning the Qld Govt to give us a useful form of registration.
Petition # 1724-11 Policy change for conditional registration for ultra light off-road vehicles (less than 500kg GVM )
http://www.parliament.qld.gov.au/work-of-assembly/petitions/e-petitions
_________________
Remember. We elect politicians, but we have to deal with bureaucracy.
Notice that crazy in the bureaucrats.

[Dino]

can-am 800rxmr wrote:

So can you guys please clarify this for me before I spend $18,000+ of my hard earned cash on a new Quad. Is there Anywhere I can Legally ride one around Townsville or am I wasting my money???. Thanks

For that money you could get a jet-ski and end up jelly-fish bait or croc poo.

Or you can just become another "forest ghost" and ride your quad and stuff the government.

Or, as previously answered, try Harvey Range Quad Bikes or get onto Far North Quad Riders.....

http://www.herveysrangequadbikes.com.au/
http://fnquadriders.com.au/index.html
_________________
Remember. We elect politicians, but we have to deal with bureaucracy.
Notice that crazy in the bureaucrats.

[Kymanic]

flipper wrote:

Things are certainly changing fast... Many of you have probably participated in ADBA (Australian Dirt Bike Adventures) rides which are usually held in the NNSW towns of Urbenville & Woodenbong. These rides are primarily on private land and State Forest. For some time the eligibility for the ride was full road rego (or more commonly conditional rego). Most riders for these events come from QLD. At the Urbenville ride last weekend, NSW Police attended and advised that they intended to charge any rider that used a bike (or quad) that didn't have lights, indicators or who broke the "speed limit" in State Forests of 60kmh. Ray Buchanan is a great guy and through negotiation seemed to get the police officers (apparently from the Lismore trail bike squad) to acknowledge that conditional registration didn't require indicators etc. I think the writing is on the wall... It seems that even for well organised events with strong pro family & common sense rules that the bureaucracy is trying to shut down all such forms of trail bike & quad bike riding. Interesting times ahead.

Do you know what ended up happening flipper ? Did everyone ride or did some pack up and asked for their money back (not sure if it's possible) ? Anyone get done for speeding etc ? We met Ray a few years ago at one of these rides, (we used to go to both W/bong and Urbenville all the time. We are not willing to renew our cond rego, so we can't enter), he's a good bloke. I thought I had alot to lose (no more forestry riding) ...... I have to agree with you, maybe the end to this type of event for non ADR / road registered machinery.
_________________
Aspire to Inspire

[flipper]

As far as I know everyone rode. The local community were fuming and intend to lodge a formal complaint with the local area command.

I only rode the Saturday and they were no where to be seen on the quad loop. Word was they breath tested some guys on the 2wheeler loop in one of the forestry sections.

Bizarre thing is unlicensed bike are in the forestry areas every weekend, cut fences, chase stock etc. (I have a farm nearby) and the police are nowhere to be seen. When riders who are licensed turn up for organized rides that have strong rules the police hassle everyone. Just does not make sense.

[Kymanic]

I could not agree with you more !
_________________
Aspire to Inspire

[Dino]

We are getting closer people. The below excerpt from a reply from TMR received today....

"In relation to recreational registration in Tasmania, the department has contacted the Department of Infrastructure, Energy and Resources, Tasmania to discuss the operation of recreational vehicles in Tasmania. I am advised that, similar to Queensland, vehicle operators are required to hold a current driver licence of the appropriate class and obtain approval from the land managers such as, Parks and Wildlife Tasmania to operate vehicles in recreational areas. The vehicle operator must also comply with restrictions imposed on the operation of recreational vehicles under the restricted registration scheme."

Further to that I am advised by our Tassie colleagues that they actually have a system of llinked trails and secondary roads which traverse several jurisdictions, like council roads, forestry and beach reserves. You can actually pull up and have a counter lunch on the ride in some areas!

Sounds good to me.....
BTW, things are getting a bit hot in TMR's policy dept apparently!
_________________
Remember. We elect politicians, but we have to deal with bureaucracy.
Notice that crazy in the bureaucrats.

[kawboy]

Mate that has to be good news and a step in the right direction....right?
Keep knocking on their door mate, you guy's are doing a fantastic job and every single person that has a quad in QLD should be very grateful for your efforts, whether they like to ride trails or not. If not atm chances are that they will sometime in the future.
_________________
"Happiness is like peeing your pants, everyone can see it but only you can feel it"

LOONEY TUNED KFX 450R
LOONEY TUNED BRUTE 765

http://www.youtube.com/user/michealmannion?feature=mhum

[gazman]

We need numbers, and "every single person in QLD who owns a quad in qld" should fill out the QLD Goverment E-petiton on this forum.
I have been told by a Motorcycle controlling body that there are only a couple of hundred persons in QLD that want rec rego so it won't bother pushing the GOV for it!! We need to show them there is a lot more.
http://www.parliament.qld.gov.au/work-of-assembly/petitions/e-petition?PetNum=1724

[kawboy]

Agreed. I have even had friends that DO NOT own quads fill out the e-petition so where are all the quad owners?
_________________
"Happiness is like peeing your pants, everyone can see it but only you can feel it"

LOONEY TUNED KFX 450R
LOONEY TUNED BRUTE 765

http://www.youtube.com/user/michealmannion?feature=mhum

[gazman]

I found this site in the GOV's own website
http://www.getinvolved.qld.gov.au/regulation/
its all about getting rid of red tape.HAAAHAAAA
i nearly fell off me chair!! And at the bottom it says"tell us about your experience" Do they really want to know??
gazman

[Dino]

From Qld State Parliament Yesterday...01 Dec 2011 Private Members’ Statements 4061..........


"Ultralight Off-Road VehiclesMr KNUTH (Dalrymple—KAP) (3.10 pm): This morning I tabled a petition of 339 signatures and
an e-petition of 314 signatures requesting a change to the conditional registration category for the use of ultralight off-road vehicles on public dirt roads and lands.

The petition calls on government to introduce a licensing endorsement condition so that public safety controls are met to replace the current police permit system, which is unworkable particularly for recreational quad users.
The use of quads has evolved so that they have become an indispensable asset on a farm, and demand for quads as a recreational vehicle almost equals that for a two-wheel trail bike. Quads are becoming increasingly important for natural disaster recovery and clean-up and rangers are now using them in national parks.

Over the past 10 years off-road vehicles have underpinned the development of farm stays, feral animal control, remote-area fishing, remote-area camping, ecotourism, mapping and navigation sports.

Unfortunately, support teams were restricted in their use of off-road vehicles because of the confusion around licensing, registration and road use. The massive increase in sales and the use of these ultralight off-road vehicles has highlighted the redundancy of the current conditional registration category system, and this petition calls on the state government to recognise that off-road vehicles such as quads need a recreational licensing and registration system.

Such a system would ensure that the users would receive appropriate training and would be able to demonstrate adequate skills to safely
operate them as well as clearly define areas of use.

Quad bikes need legal access to minor roads and public lands such as state forests and national parks to ensure safety and sustainable growth of a major tourism and recreational industry and to give users and local authorities clear, workable guidelines to enable successful integration.

The recreational water vehicle licensing and registration system was in response to a genuine need to regulate and educate users. Off-road vehicle groups have identified a similar need and it is urgent that the government responds to prevent—
(Time expired)"

So, we have reached another milestone in our campaign for a fair go. Parliament resumes in the new year and we'll see what the Govt comes up with, other than calling a election.

Dino.
_________________
Remember. We elect politicians, but we have to deal with bureaucracy.
Notice that crazy in the bureaucrats.

[bullet]

Well done Dino. Massive effort, well done

so far...
_________________
Can-Am X Team
Bullet #Y12. MrsB #Y18.

[gazman]

Fantastic,looks like things may change.
I was wondering how this will affect kids riding in the bush???
gazman

[Dino]

So much has been happenning in the last few weeks, a person would think there is a election coming!
Some higher level meetings have taken place, and some even higher level communications are happening.
It is now a very complex issue for them, and a functional form of registration is a key to solving so many problems they now have.
Some lights are coming on........
This was related to part of a communication from the Premiers Office:
http://www.nzta.govt.nz/resources/factsheets/19/index.html
I doubt that is what we'd get offered, and I don't want people to be misled, but seeing as the Federal and NZ governments are working together on a broader range of issues, it is a step towards reality.
Would we lke to see this in Aus?
Short version, we are much closer to our goals.
_________________
Remember. We elect politicians, but we have to deal with bureaucracy.
Notice that crazy in the bureaucrats.

[kawboy]

WHAT A JOKE!!

http://www.parliament.qld.gov.au/apps/EPetitions_qld/Responses/1724%20&%201837.pdf
_________________
"Happiness is like peeing your pants, everyone can see it but only you can feel it"

LOONEY TUNED KFX 450R
LOONEY TUNED BRUTE 765

http://www.youtube.com/user/michealmannion?feature=mhum

[Dino]

kawboy wrote:

WHAT A JOKE!! http://www.parliament.qld.gov.au/apps/EPetitions_qld/Responses/1724%20&%201837.pdf

This was about what we expected from her. She is allowed to say that on the way out the door. ( expect and make changes for the election. )
We are acknowledged as requesting change and will be asking to explain her departments "safety" reasoning, beyond the obvious stonewalling.

Fancy having a policy advisor that didn't know what ADR's are? She does!
_________________
Remember. We elect politicians, but we have to deal with bureaucracy.
Notice that crazy in the bureaucrats.

[Kymanic]

Did someone from a Qld dept vote in the poll a the top of this page lol? 1 has voted no.

I know some don't agree with me on this, but I still stand by what I said a while back, it's the non ADR issue that kills us, and, unfortunately this minister has clearly pointed that out.

Please don't shoot me down, I WANT a FAIRER and LEGAL registration scheme probably more than anyone, but I really think this will be ''their'' sticking point to always fall back on. I'm not sure whether ''can do'' can fix it either, he may try if elected but will probably be snow balled by red tape

Anyhow let the battle to get a BETTER rego scheme continue .........
We've taken a hit but I'm still keen to protest !
_________________
Aspire to Inspire

[Predatory]

Keep it up lads
All I can say is I am happy to be back in WA!!!!!!
_________________
Its not if you win or lose but how you enjoyed the ride!

[Dino]

I'm hearing whispers of a election promise about looking at rec rego.......
_________________
Remember. We elect politicians, but we have to deal with bureaucracy.
Notice that crazy in the bureaucrats.

[kawboy]

Hmm......keep us posted Dino.
_________________
"Happiness is like peeing your pants, everyone can see it but only you can feel it"

LOONEY TUNED KFX 450R
LOONEY TUNED BRUTE 765

http://www.youtube.com/user/michealmannion?feature=mhum

[Kymanic]

Hee hee, an election promise to LOOK at rec rego ........... why won't they say it WILL be changed if elected.
Sorry.... just my thoughts on politicians and their promises

Still, I guess, if these whispers are true, then it must mean someone has it in the back of their mind which is a step in the right direction.
_________________
Aspire to Inspire

[Dino]

A few of you know that I've been lobbying our cause with the various political parties and advisors, as we head towards the pentulimate Qld popularity contest.

What local candidates say, and what their respective parties will do are different things.
Some ministerial advisors are cleaning out their desks, while certain departmental advisors are busy planning their future, which includes shoe identification for optimal licking performance.

Who people vote for, in their own electorates is up to them. But for the 50 odd thousand quad riders out there, who may actually consider a better level of access as a part of the big picture, the below star rating is from the respective parties and their attitude to trail riding and quad rego that works that I have experienced thus far these last few years.

ALP. 3 stars.For actually being allowed to be dragged kicking and crying with a cattle prodder to meetings, and admitting the administration has issues with our issues and that their reasoning and understanding what actually is available to us is very flawed. Awaiting for the election to pass. Numerous meetings with departmental and ministerial advisors, local MP's and Ministers.

LNP. 1 star. For having all the information for long enough to actually concieve a child, have it and enroll it in kindy. A definate maybe look at it after the election, if they are successful. Flat out getting a email back, until reminded that there was estimated to be some 50 000 quads in the state.....

The Greens. 0 stars OMG, you want to what? What about the children? What about the trees? I responded that kids ride too and that only possums and fruit bats play in trees and pretty much left it at that....

A few minor parties and independants. 1 star Interested and supportive if someone else actually brings anything into parliament, but not confident enough to do it themselves. emails and phone calls.

KAP 5 stars. Had a meeting organised in nothing flat, asked intelligent questions and discussed the many portfolios these issues involved. They were of the opinion that we had clearly identified the hold ups and the issues and were very happy to pursue the matter post election. The meeting was with the Qld Party Leader and a certain Federal Senator.
_________________
Remember. We elect politicians, but we have to deal with bureaucracy.
Notice that crazy in the bureaucrats.

[Dino]

I attended a big pow wow tonight.....

The optomistic version, by "them"(DERM), is wait and see what happens with the new government. The policy statements thus far are hardly more than ambigous, and short of real meaning.
The realistic version is that National Park and Wildlife will survive on it's own. A big bust up is on the cards. They are expecting "new orders" via departmental heads, over the next few weeks, however.
The good news is we've one some ground with Group Activity Permits, and I really upset them when I asked for the re-instatement of individual permits.
Why? Because it would be a further admission that discriminating against the 97% of forest users that are not part of the club scene, are mainly good people who are sick of being treated as the lowest common denomiator. A lot more than just quads involved here...
i.e. That most people don't like being treated like criminals. They would happily pay a fee for access to prescribed conditions of conduct and access. Such a programme wouldn't stop "Danny Dickheads", but would encourage more legal use for most of us. I'll be pursuing that issue very hard......

A certain representative from the Dept of Sport & Rec was utterly dismayed when it was pointed out that Wyaralong fell massively short of the mark for most of Qld.
And I quote myself: "Putting all the eggs in one basket doesn't work when the eggs are spread across 10 million square kilometres, sport."

We also had some grandaddy greens. ( Think 1970's founding members in Tassie...) I fried, baked and roasted them.

The state election may be done and dusted, but the local councl elections are near. It won't hurt to get into the faces of local candidates and newly elected MP's, and ask them what their own, and their parties, have as a regard to outdoor recreation policy.
Enjoy the look of confusion on theie faces when you tell them "excluding ball sports".
_________________
Remember. We elect politicians, but we have to deal with bureaucracy.
Notice that crazy in the bureaucrats.