OZ ATV :: The Australian ATV Forum

[old 303]

Heard stories & just checked the
MA website re rule changes for Quads updated March 2011. Maximum width at rear tyres to be 1270 mm down from 1400 mm.
Has anyone had this enforced or discussed yet at club meets ?

If enforced its going to cost everyone some money not to mention handling changes.
_________________
Old 303

[hustleratv.com.au]

It's enforced now, quads were measured at kamfari this year.
_________________
hustleratv.com.au 0407 797 780
Importer of OMF performance product / wheels
Maxxis Tyres
Boundless Suspention
Bad Boy Power Drinks

[Linc]

It's stll 50in wide......

[Roycroft]

i think this particular rule change is not called for. why 1270mm ? what was wroung with the 1400mm and no tolerence?
_________________
2012 sponsors, Working on it.

[old 303]

Not sure why the changes were made but wouldnt mind someone in the MA fraternity or simalir giving a formal explanation to this & other recent changes.

I'm new to the quad scene but would like to now the background along with many others I presume.
_________________
Old 303

[bullet]

Fair enough, i'll try to explain the 1270mm rule as i see it, and hopefully that helps more that it invites argument.

From back in the 2004 days onward, Quads were becoming very expensive toys to race. Top Pro class, Vets class and even the odd Clubman racer owned heavily aftermarket equiped $35,000 machines to do the job.
In recent years Club level racing has seen a decline in top level racers and 'one' common reason given was the cost to stay competative in top level quad racing.
The GFC has flow on effects that that are still hitting the Aussie quad scene, and making our sport as attractive as possible by making it cheaper to get into is a sound idea.
Lately, manufacturers have been coming out with fairly inpressive so called 'race ready' machines under 50 inches wide.
Seeing as No manufacturer in the world makes a quad wider than 50 inches (1270mm) it is a logical limit to place to help encourage more fair, consistent, and cheaper racing. In fact, because the US racing rule is 50 inches, the vast majority of aftermarket accessories are aimed at bringing the older style 46 inch quads up to the 1270mm dimension.

Some other disciplines in the US run wider than the majority 50 inch spec.
And maybe they have the numbers to do that there. But in the interests of greatest discipline growth here in Australia, the 1270mm rule is across the board.
This effectively means that quad racers in Australia can effectively cross disciplines without so much pressure to spend money on their quads to make their machine technically competative in any other discipline.
Essentially making it cheaper and easier for 'new' members to try different types of racing on basically the same quad.

The closer we can race quads to a standard set of specifications, the easier it should be for our sport to grow.
For all the GFC reasons, riders and manufacturers, in 2011 and 2012, sport growth will need all the help it can get.

That's pretty condensed, but i hope it helps
_________________
Can-Am X Team
Bullet #Y12. MrsB #Y18.

[breno213]

Comment removed sorry guys
_________________
All Thanks to=
Q.R.S.A my club
Yamaha pittmans
Roll design
and my family for all there support #213 #172#619 #247

Last edited by breno213 on Tue Jun 07, 2011 11:26 am; edited 1 time in total

[X-Factor 1]

hustleratv.com.au wrote:

It's enforced now, quads were measured at kamfari this year.

Its a game person that runs wider than 1270mm in Kamfari
_________________
Darren Colbert
X-Factor Engineering Atv Racing
Canam Renegade / Ds 450

[muzzgit]

Breno, could you explain to me how lowering my quad or changing the sag is going to make it wider???
_________________
Cheers,
MUZZ
06 YFM 700R mine
03 KFX 400 hers

[breno213]

Your just gonna have a look your self ive lifted all the sag out an got an inch narrower an put sag in an pushed down on it an it is wider again im on the 51 now an i gotta take most of my sag out to get it on 50 or go out an buy new omf bead locks by changeing the off set witch is around $700 think the new rule change is stupid think they need to worry about how many people will stop racing if they make to many stupid rule changes
_________________
All Thanks to=
Q.R.S.A my club
Yamaha pittmans
Roll design
and my family for all there support #213 #172#619 #247

[bullet]

_________________
Can-Am X Team
Bullet #Y12. MrsB #Y18.

Last edited by bullet on Tue Jun 07, 2011 2:46 pm; edited 1 time in total

[Linc]

1400mm is very wide and one day it had to be changed. I havent looked at the FIM rules lately but I'm pretty sure they changed their rules to about 50" but utilities are allowed to be a litle bit wider (+2" I think)...

I think 1300mm would have been a fairer choice as it allows for 50" and a bit of a margin, it's still 100mm narrower than the old rule. The 50" wide rule is really only applicable to MX in the USA and the desert guys run wider and longer; many aftermarket a-arms will put you just over 50". A utility with aftermarket wheels and tyres can put you just over 50" as well.

Something had to change eventually but I don't really like that this rule was dropped with no warning or consultation after the season has started.

Linc

[breno213]

Yes your probly right there bullet but i never intended to when i started out yes im a bit pead off with this rule an it was never mention at any time of us standing face to face i apolagise for my post an will remove it for the sake of the sport an our club. I should of used my head. But ive been on edge since our last enduro an im sure ill mention that to at the meeting ive given up smokeing an i have inherited an attitude problem at this moment im sure ill shake it. Ill Talk to at the meeting where it will be more conveinant. Over this matter my bike is safe depending on how you messure it.

Last edited by breno213 on Tue Jun 07, 2011 1:05 pm; edited 1 time in total

[Roycroft]

Linc wrote:

1400mm is very wide and one day it had to be changed. I havent looked at the FIM rules lately but I'm pretty sure they changed their rules to about 50" but utilities are allowed to be a litle bit wider (+2" I think)... I think 1300mm would have been a fairer choice as it allows for 50" and a bit of a margin, it's still 100mm narrower than the old rule. The 50" wide rule is really only applicable to MX in the USA and the desert guys run wider and longer; many aftermarket a-arms will put you just over 50". A utility with aftermarket wheels and tyres can put you just over 50" as well. Something had to change eventually but I don't really like that this rule was dropped with no warning or consultation after the season has started. Linc

spot in Linc

i think a +1 inch varience or a staggered drop from 1400mm to 1270mm over the next few years would of been the best way to do it. but i still think the rule didn't really need changing i have raced and against quads that have been upwards to 1400mm and to me it makes no difference, its just personal setup preference

i am concerned that the MA quad deligates have changed this rule when not needed. there is also other rules that have been changed like the bumpers and no sharp pruting metal that i think needs to be re thought
is there going to be a list of banned bumpers provided by MA as this rule is very relaxed and open to arguments at scrutineering of what is prutuding and what is not?
prutuding means sticking out, all bumpers stick out and sharp means knife like, cutting. no bumper made that i have ever seen would have sharp cutting bits?

i don't know any bumper that falls under this category, but i know of a heap of bumpers that will most likely not pass because of the relaxed wording of this rule and no real evidence to why these bumpers would be dangerous.

these are my thoughts only on the bumper issue and our state deligate was aware of my concerns on this rule, however now that the rule is in place i have been told that the Pure Polaris bumper would not able to be used as it has prutruding metal. but if you look at it closely the end bars are closed and sweep backwards towards the frame, there is no way of it being dangerous if i hit somebody.
_________________
2012 sponsors, Working on it.

[Linc]

Roycroft wrote:

however now that the rule is in place i have been told that the Pure Polaris bumper would not able to be used as it has prutruding metal. but if you look at it closely the end bars are closed and sweep backwards towards the frame, there is no way of it being dangerous if i hit somebody.

The whole "sharp or protruding extremities" rule is needed of course but it is wide open to interpretation. If the Pure Polaris bumper I'm thinking of is the one you speak of then then that is a pretty harsh interpretation of the rule. If you apply the same thinking to all other bumpers then we will not have much to chose from.

In the case of the Polaris bumper if it does bend back towards the frame then I would make the arguement that by definition nothing that sweeps backwards towards the frame can be considered an "extremity".

Linc

[hustleratv.com.au]

breno213 wrote:

ive given up smokeing an i have inherited an attitude problem at this moment im sure ill shake it.

Thats great new breno keep it up , if you ever get the urge to smoke call me and i will do my best to get your mind off it.

I have never smoked so i dont know how hard it is to quit but it's a must thing to do , i have lost alot of family/friends to the cancer prick.
_________________
hustleratv.com.au 0407 797 780
Importer of OMF performance product / wheels
Maxxis Tyres
Boundless Suspention
Bad Boy Power Drinks

[breno213]

Thanks mate after been in hospital an scaring my kids is the last thing i wanted to happen so yes ive quit an wont be letting them down or my self again. lifes to short to make it any shorter. Should of done this years ago in stead of waiting on a wake up call
_________________
All Thanks to=
Q.R.S.A my club
Yamaha pittmans
Roll design
and my family for all there support #213 #172#619 #247

[ATV PRO]

This is the Email I sent to NSW ATV Club and some ATV riders in NSW

Hello Quad people,

MA have a quad committee with a delegate appointed in each state http://www.ma.org.au/index.php?id=113#c1008

The delegates are generally passionate people of the sport, that volunteer advise and services to quad riders/racers and can be a link or voice to MA for the people.

I am the appointed Quad Delegate for NSW, my contact details are M 0422 479788 or Email len@atvnrg.com.au

I am confident most of you are aware Motorcycling Australia (MA) is the controlling body of Motorcycle sport in Australia including ATV's

NSW people if you would like to discuss concerns, changes or add any rules to the GCR's then I am more than happy to discuss these with you, the other delegates and in turn MA.

I have attached some information and links below for you to check out.

About MA http://www.ma.org.au/index.php?id=8

Motorcycling Australia GCR's "General Competition Rules"

GCR's are found in the MoMS "Manual of Motorcycle Sports "http://www.ma.org.au/fileadmin/user_upload/Documents/MOMS/2011_MoMS_Folder/MoMsWebsitefinal.pdf

Quad Rule Changes MoM's 11/03/2011
http://www.ma.org.au/fileadmin/user_upload/Documents/MOMS/2011_MoMS_Folder/New_2011_Quad_GCR_s.pdf

Making Rules and changes to rule http://www.ma.org.au/index.php?id=138

Rule Amendment or Inclusion form http://www.ma.org.au/index.php?id=759

I suggest you have a say if you would like to voice your opinion on any rule or wording.

As mentioned their is a Delegate in each state contact them for clarity .

I encourage NSW ATV people to cc me or you are welcome to contact me or go direct to MA .

If you are from another state please contact your delegate or MA direct as you choose.

The Quad delegates will get together in the year and discuss the rules and requests for change to have input and a certain degree influence ,however MA implement these rules and have the final say, not the delegates

Personally I believe the Width rule should be a maximum of 1300mm for all disciplines and I have entered my reasoning to MA through the link attached, it is simple to me make an allowance for slight rim and tyre changes to encourage participation of our sport, not limit or discourage.
Good luck
_________________
Cheers
Len

ATV PRO Pty Ltd

[Mrs_Gaitar]

Personally I believe the Width rule should be a maximum of 1300mm for all disciplines and I have entered my reasoning to MA through the link attached, it is simple to me make an allowance for slight rim and tyre changes to encourage participation of our sport, not limit or discourage.
Good luck



Totaly agree with you !
with the declining numbers we need to encourage !
_________________
www.waquadmx.com

[ATV PRO]

breno213 wrote:

Thanks mate after been in hospital an scaring my kids is the last thing i wanted to happen so yes ive quit an wont be letting them down or my self again. lifes to short to make it any shorter. Should of done this years ago in stead of waiting on a wake up call

Hey Breno ,
I smoked til I was about 38 (Now 47) my mum died of it .
I used the Nicoret inhalers as they gave me a hit of Nico when I needed it and the throat felt it then the figget hand thing was sorted .
Its hard thing to do but so worth it ,now food is my vice !
Be persistent and hate it ,good luck !
_________________
Cheers
Len

ATV PRO Pty Ltd

[ATV PRO]

Linc wrote:

1400mm is very wide and one day it had to be changed. I havent looked at the FIM rules lately but I'm pretty sure they changed their rules to about 50" but utilities are allowed to be a litle bit wider (+2" I think)... I think 1300mm would have been a fairer choice as it allows for 50" and a bit of a margin, it's still 100mm narrower than the old rule. The 50" wide rule is really only applicable to MX in the USA and the desert guys run wider and longer; many aftermarket a-arms will put you just over 50". A utility with aftermarket wheels and tyres can put you just over 50" as well. Something had to change eventually but I don't really like that this rule was dropped with no warning or consultation after the season has started. Linc

Fully Agree Linc, 1300mm is a good number. I will be campaigning this at the next MA delegate meeting.
I hope people forward what they want the rules to be with MA
_________________
Cheers
Len

ATV PRO Pty Ltd

[ATV PRO]

Roycroft wrote:

Linc wrote: 1400mm is very wide and one day it had to be changed. I havent looked at the FIM rules lately but I'm pretty sure they changed their rules to about 50" but utilities are allowed to be a litle bit wider (+2" I think)... I think 1300mm would have been a fairer choice as it allows for 50" and a bit of a margin, it's still 100mm narrower than the old rule. The 50" wide rule is really only applicable to MX in the USA and the desert guys run wider and longer; many aftermarket a-arms will put you just over 50". A utility with aftermarket wheels and tyres can put you just over 50" as well. Something had to change eventually but I don't really like that this rule was dropped with no warning or consultation after the season has started. Linc spot in Linc i think a +1 inch varience or a staggered drop from 1400mm to 1270mm over the next few years would of been the best way to do it. but i still think the rule didn't really need changing i have raced and against quads that have been upwards to 1400mm and to me it makes no difference, its just personal setup preference i am concerned that the MA quad deligates have changed this rule when not needed. there is also other rules that have been changed like the bumpers and no sharp pruting metal that i think needs to be re thought is there going to be a list of banned bumpers provided by MA as this rule is very relaxed and open to arguments at scrutineering of what is prutuding and what is not? prutuding means sticking out, all bumpers stick out and sharp means knife like, cutting. no bumper made that i have ever seen would have sharp cutting bits? i don't know any bumper that falls under this category, but i know of a heap of bumpers that will most likely not pass because of the relaxed wording of this rule and no real evidence to why these bumpers would be dangerous. these are my thoughts only on the bumper issue and our state deligate was aware of my concerns on this rule, however now that the rule is in place i have been told that the Pure Polaris bumper would not able to be used as it has prutruding metal. but if you look at it closely the end bars are closed and sweep backwards towards the frame, there is no way of it being dangerous if i hit somebody.

Hi Mick,

I am one of those people, sorry .

It has to be safety first as ATV's have had a bad reputation in the past.

MA has a duty of care policy and as a governing body need to protect its members the best way they can .They are also need to satisfy the changing requirements of insurance companies.

You just have to look at new bull bars on Ford Motor cars and some 4x4's. They are rounded and plastic so if they hit a pedestrian they do less damage. Insurers are driving the market down the safety road.

I believe the Pure bumper is not allowed in USA MX racing due to its sharp extremities to the side ,they are capped tube but would do a lot more damage than a looped design.

Personally I would not like to be on a track or be rider and hit by the edge a pure (Or sharp )bumper and understand why the USA wont allow them in a race . Race bumpers should be flat and rounded on the sides, top and edges out of harms way. Most manufactures make a suitable race bumper in the range.
Other bumpers that come to a point at the front and some below are also dangerous .
It should be Safety before Bling on the race track.
_________________
Cheers
Len

ATV PRO Pty Ltd

[breno213]

I had a good talk with bullet last night about this matter an found it very interesting its not as bad as i thought it was cheers bullet for explaining it to me i realy dont think its gonna bother to many people after all.
_________________
All Thanks to=
Q.R.S.A my club
Yamaha pittmans
Roll design
and my family for all there support #213 #172#619 #247

[old 303]

Len,

Appreciate the response. One thing has come out of this discussion for me is that the quad scene although generally less in numbers than our 2 wheel brothers is full of passionate enthusiastic people.


Its refreshing to see that although some initial responses are quickly posted in hast, everyone has the one end goal which is riding quads in whatever form they wish.

Thanks again.
_________________
Old 303

[breno213]

ATV PRO wrote:

breno213 wrote: Thanks mate after been in hospital an scaring my kids is the last thing i wanted to happen so yes ive quit an wont be letting them down or my self again. lifes to short to make it any shorter. Should of done this years ago in stead of waiting on a wake up call Hey Breno , I smoked til I was about 38 (Now 47) my mum died of it . I used the Nicoret inhalers as they gave me a hit of Nico when I needed it and the throat felt it then the figget hand thing was sorted . Its hard thing to do but so worth it ,now food is my vice ! Be persistent and hate it ,good luck !

Thanks len. Your right about food it has taken over still havnt had a smoke nore fill the need for one i think im wining this fight. With the reaper. I to lost my mother inlaw from cancer not a pretty thing.
_________________
All Thanks to=
Q.R.S.A my club
Yamaha pittmans
Roll design
and my family for all there support #213 #172#619 #247