OZ ATV :: The Australian ATV Forum

[morebloodymoney]

I posted a topic about how p#ssed off i was a couple of months ago about my ltr 450 3rd gear drama's , just thought I'd let you know how it is all progressing , or in my case deteriorating.

After 5 hours from new i found gear teeth when changing the oil , so i did the right thing, parked the bike and contacted my suzuki dealer and let him know , bring her down he said and we'll have a look , thats when the crap started.

This should be a warrenty claim hey mate! No he said because i put a cherry bomb on it and i raced it its not covered even though the web site says 6 months warrenty suzuki won't give you a claim! Go figure.

So i ripped the engine out and was about to split it when someone said to get in touch with suzuki australia and tell them your situation, so i spoke to them and they said to take it to an authorised suzuki dealer and if they find a fault with it they will pay for labour, so i humped the engine in the ute made the 5 hour round trip and dropped it off, 2 weeks later made another 5 hour trip and dropped off the billet gears and then on saturday made yet another 5 hour trip and picked it up.

That will be $418 dollars thanks he said , and i told him that suzuki said if they found it to be there fault that they would pay for it , no he said suzuki won,t pay it , so this has now cost me $1000 dollars for the 2 billet gears, 1 shift pin relocator and labour, now i'm getting p#ssed off.

Put the engine in yesterday and put 400 ml of oil in the sump and it started to leak out of the left hand side cover , so i pulled it off and found they hadn't installed the gasket properely so i fixed it and put oil back in and it didn't leak, great i thought its fixed now, so i then put 1300 ml in the oil tank and started it up and ran it for about 10 seconds and checked the oil level and there was'nt a drop on the dip stick, put another 100 ml in and started it up and it ran for about 20 seconds and it like seized instantly, found out the return pump was'nt pumping so it sucked all the oil out of the tank but was'nt pumping it back in, so then i took the cover off yet again to get to the oil pump only to find the fly wheel had to come off to get to it.

I then put the gear lever on and went to click it into gear and it would'nt go in , i tried up and down and it still would'nt go in.The d##kheads put it back togeather wrong, so i humped the piece of s#it on the back of the ute , chucked the plastics on the back seat and made yet another 5 hour round trip and dropped the turd off. I want my fffffnn money back i said to the halfwit, i bought this thing to race i didn't buy it because i like fixing it. You will have to take it up with suzuki australia he said, so i got home and i rang suzuki (by this time i wanna burn everything thats yellow) and told them what had happened and he said he felt sorry for me and the dealer should have done a better job than that ,but they wont refund my money. So now i own a $11000 peace of sh#t. Good work supuki on making a solid gear box and having a good dealer that will fix your bike when you have a problem and will also be up front about warrenty claims. Well done! Two middle fingers up to you.

Dave sims Mundubbera.

[feralkid]

Thats no good. Send a copy of that to Suzuki Australia and say you have posted on a big forum and have told everybody that you know and that heaps of people read these posts. See what they say to that.
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"If in doubt go flat out"
"Nothing worth having is easy to get"

[shagger]

Thats Fooked up big time!!!!!! Surely there is something that can be done. A current affair maybe???

[Barney]

I would suggest you contact your consumer affairs dept and make a written complaint against the dealer and also Suzuki i would also suggest that you make enquiries to how many others that have this problem and have to show documentation to your consumer affairs have a look on other forum in the us and show them as well
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2012 Can am Outlander Xt 1000cc
Can Am Full set of Armour ,Grip and thumb warmer
Fox Podium Shocks and springs front and back
GME Tx 4600 UHF with Helmet Mic
Hema Gps

[morebloodymoney]

Feral kid i have already told them and they don't care. They can't even make up there mind if its a race bike or not, the first time i spoke to them they said i shouldn't have a cherry bomb on it and that was more or less why 3rd gear failed and it was a no no to race it. Have a look on there web site and it says don't just race , race to win.Pffft But apparantly its ok to rev the tits out of it and flat shift every gear change as long as your not on a track then they might cover you, What crap, I have never been rough on any of my bikes transmissions and never had a problem. They can't keep there story straight , today suzuki australia told me that you have to expect failures because there so high performance and i told them i race against other high performance bikes and gears arn't droppin out of theres. mmmm He couldn't answer that one .

[bigjon]

There's many ways you could have handled this better, but what's done is done. I would contact your Consumer Affairs or Office of Fair Trading immediately. Get someone that is a good writer to do it for you. It needs to be detailed & accurate. It needs to have dates, names, responses, and what you believe to be a fair outcome.

If your not at fault & have reasonable demands it will usually go your way. I doubt you get your money back (for the purchase price) but I would expect to get my quad repaired FOC.

Best of luck.
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Don't close your eyes during the crash, you'll miss the best part

[Roycroft]

thats why they are selling them so cheap, i belive they are having massive problems with the 08 models, i owned a 06 model not one issue for 2 years then i changed to Can Am.

we are all feeling your frustration as it just shouldn't happen. and if it does then you expect some co-operation from the manufature.
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2012 sponsors, Working on it.

[Huskygoat]

PM the v8toy between us we can sort your engine out as we doing his ltr .

MY experience when you get to this stage with the shop the only thing that works is fresh dog sh!t in a envelope addressed to the manager written on it who opens has just won $1000 bucks

Huskygoat

that's sick isn't it . I might edit it later

[v8toy]

yeah mate give her to me ill fix it i havent split mine totally yet but from what i can see is it has done 3rd gear from breaking a shift fork or something and has meshed with another gear and made a mess i can see all this thru a machined hole in the engine cases.

ill be pulling it apart tomorrow afternoon and i will post a couple of pics of whats damaged.

unfair to u mate on the dealer i used to work for a dealer and he used to do everything in his power to help along a warranty claim wether motox or rec bike but u should def chase it up further cause after all it is a factory fault

mines had a floggin for the past year (07 model) in a few races and i consider myself hard on bikes (opinion welcome husky lol) but has only just destroed it self now.

dont let it go mate, go as far as u have to

stewy
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go hard or go home

[Dingo555]

morebloodymoney, sounds like a dealer issue more than anything. I was told 3 months warranty on competition bikes. I was sold new 07 ltr (oct 06), cherry bomb, dmc pipe, kill switch and nerfs. Destroyed gearbox at 3 months 1 week, took it back to them race numbers and all (reminded them it spent 2 weeks in their shop for first service, valve set etc.) and they fully covered a quoted $3000 job. Maybe like most seem to be saying you need to be pushing Suzuki Australia a little more. Just keep moving further up the food chain until you find somebody that will listen. There does seem to be some good fixes coming onto the scene, but it does come down to the repairer....That first rebuild on my box lasted nearly 18 months of what my mates would only refer to as abuse before it grenaded again which this time cost me $1700 to repair (this includes all the cylinder work, piston etc. as well, labour myself) If I had more time I would have waited for the improved gear sets and all that, but the Qld titles are too close and being on my doorstep I couldn't miss it... Good luck
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10 LTR 555 Dingo
06 LTR 94 Kay
Thanks for all the support and good advice
ATVPRO
Colac Motorcylces
Luke Beechey Motorsports
Proud supporter of Team Ironpot
No skills or good habits, just point it and stab it..!!

[hammer686]

plenty of chatter on US sites on ltr tranny.... think suki has patented standard response "this is the first time we heard of this".
You prob don't want to but dealer is obligated to repair his repair work if not call fair trading sometimes they will call dealer/mechanic & advise them of there legal obligations. No chance of a refund - if its not repaired to your satisfaction get the wigs at fair trading/consumer affairs to sort it out. Like bigjon said document all dealings you had with dealer/manufacturer + photos help as well.
Hope things work out for you.
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Raptor 700

[morebloodymoney]

Thanks guys for your support, i think after time to reflect that the main issue is dealer incompetence, i didn't spend $1000 at that shop as i got the billet gears and shift pin relocator from someone else. When i received the gears the guy told me what to watch out for when reassembling the engine, i told him i took it to a dealer and he told me to tell them to check the 2nd oil pump as it can fill up with junk from the 3rd failures. So i rang my dealer and told him that and he more or less told me we know what we are doing and don't worry.

Well they obviously don't know as it wasn't pupming a drop even with 1800 ml in the crankase, but how can you stuff it up with all the support that suzuki would give them (manuals and tech) they still got it wrong, but thats not what p@ssed me off the most as i went to put it in to gear and there was nothing there , it was solid , up or down , nothing , then the gasket , how hard is it to put a gasket on? Suzuki australia tells me one thing saying they will cover it , labor , gaskets , parts (except the billet gears and shift pin) and these crack smokin idiots tell me another, oh were sorry but suzuki won't cover labour . I even made it easy for them as all they had to do was split it , i removed the engine from the bike and handed it to them.

Maybe if i'd taken it to someone who knew what they were doing i wouldn't be typing this now, but i did exactly what suzuki australia said and i still have no bike, i just hate to think what these idiots will do with the whole bike now.mmm mabey put the engine in backwards or maybe upside down, as far as i'm concerned they can keep the 5 hour turd!.

[BC250R]

A couple of years back, the shop i was working for was taken to Consumer Affairs by a customer. The shop sold professional audio to muso's etc. There is a cheap chinese brand that is a get what you pay for mens to an end. (Audio equivilent to GMC tools). Customer purchases this brand knowing full well of its quality issues. Customer gets pissed of with us over another matter and decides to give us grief by taking us to CA's saying his equipment is noisy (hissing). Every single product from this company is, you get what you pay for. Anyhow, customer shows up in court with a glossy brochure put ut by the manufacturer claiming "professional quality" "Ultra low noise", even though the same brochure has specs on it that say otherwise. Customer wins case as manufacturer made a statement on this brochure as to what it feels the customer can expect from their product. This item was over 12months out of warranty. Judge ruled that the customer was entitled to replacement or money back. He also stated that warranty terms are not legally binding in Consumer Affairs Court and that judgements are made on what is fair and reasonable to the customer. He also stated that the customer is ruled in favour of 90% of the time to send a message to big business to be more reasonable with customers so that matters need not go to court. Our shop was exempt from any wrong doing and the blame put with the manufacturer. Manufacturerhad plenty of cash to fight it but found it easier to keep customer happy and make it go away quickly.

I say take it up legally and kick their arse.

Goodluck with it, BC
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Technical info thread
http://www.ozatv.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4425

[EXrider]

I feel for you, but just stay cool, document everything, every phone call who you speak to, what was said, that is why I like an email response because you have hard copy of what was said.

And keep hounding them, that old saying " the squeaky door gets oiled" is so true.
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05 400ex
Bog stock

[Dingo555]

I would also direct the Suzuki reps to this site to see all the negative feedback being generated...
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10 LTR 555 Dingo
06 LTR 94 Kay
Thanks for all the support and good advice
ATVPRO
Colac Motorcylces
Luke Beechey Motorsports
Proud supporter of Team Ironpot
No skills or good habits, just point it and stab it..!!

[morebloodymoney]

Dingo555 wrote:

I would also direct the Suzuki reps to this site to see all the negative feedback being generated...

Yeah dingo555 i have thought of that and i have also thought of taking a great big picture of of the bike with all the reasons why people shouldn't buy one of these and putting it in front of our pit tent, but whats it gonna achieve, i think all it would do is harm the reputation of the good dealers out there who do the right thing by there customers(and i know they are out there because i have a good relationship with our yamaha dealer) and it also wouldn't look good to the spectators who walk through the pits looking to get into the sport (and also the 2 wheel guys who finally woke up to themselves that 4 wheels are better than two)but if they start to see stuff like look my ltr 450 08 s#it itself after 5 hours and i haven't Had the bike going now for 8 weeks and my dealer couldn't be trusted putting a stamp on an envelope, they might think twice about buying a quad and i don't think that would be a good outcome for the sport.

I also think the guys from suzuki check these forums regularly and they know what is going on they just choose to take the hear no see no and we have never heard of that approach, anyway i think i have already cost them sales buy this thread, i know 2 guys from our local club were looking at buying an 08 ltr but when i told them i found some gear teeth in the oil , guess what they wont be buying. I spoke to fair trading this afternoon and i will be taking the matter further as they said i have a very strong case and to push for a full refund.They said suzuki has an obligation to supply a quality product with out defect and after 5 hours and having a major problem i am entitled to either having the problem fixed for free which they couldn't do, not only did they charge me labour but they also couldn't fix the problem, so I'm am now pushing for a full refund of purchase, they said even though its a race bike and designed for racing 5 hours is an unacceptable amount of time to have major problems occuring , so tonight we have to type up a letter and send a copy to our dealer and explain why we are taking the matter to the office of fair trading and if he doesen't reply we are to send a copy to fair trading and they will take the matter up. So i will keep you guys informed of the outcome . Cheers dave.

[Barney]

What makes me think a bit is ,, this Question

Why didnt the dealer that fixed your bike note a problem after the repairs , and how long did they run the engine for after putting it back together ,, answers i think that you should be looking for.

I dont know of many mechanics that would not start and test the machine after a major repair like that was done , it was then they should of picked up there stuff up as well ,,,

Just my thoughts stick it up em make someone pay.


And i will stick to my ol grizzly lol

Hope you get some satisfaction from your efforts

Cheers
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2012 Can am Outlander Xt 1000cc
Can Am Full set of Armour ,Grip and thumb warmer
Fox Podium Shocks and springs front and back
GME Tx 4600 UHF with Helmet Mic
Hema Gps

[v8toy]

as a bike mechanic myself wether u get an angine without the bike or with the first thing they teach u in tech and is common sense also is as soon as the cases are back together before the piston before the clutch b4 everything else almost u grab the gearlever and run thru the gears on the bench same with the kickstart assembly and as soon as the head and cams are installed beats me why this mechanic didnt do any of it at the end of the day it saves him the heartache of pulling it own again
wonder what weetbix packet he came from
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go hard or go home

[hammer686]

Dingo555 wrote:

I would also direct the Suzuki reps to this site to see all the negative feedback being generated...

"see no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil"

http://www.lt-r450central.com/invision/index.php?showtopic=4693&st=0
http://www.lt-r450central.com/invision/index.php?showtopic=6112&hl=08+transmission
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Raptor 700

[morebloodymoney]

Oh yeah guys i almost forgot to tell you the clutch is like way harder to pull in now as well, just thought i'd tell you that seeing i'm venting my anger, and the reason they didn't start the bike in the shop is because i had to remove the engine so i had the bike and they had the engine as the dealer led me to beleive it wouldn't be covered so i was gonna split it myself untill i got in touch with suzuki aust and they said they would cover it . but in the end they didn't.

[v8toy]

they should still have rotated the countershaft whilst goin thru the gears on the bench u'd prob allready know that though
what dealer was it

this might be a slight hijack but heres a couple of pics from my ltr's box i pulled apart tonight


circled damaged gear

here u can see the missing teeth and the half missing teeth

[b]same gears but here u can see the damge to the surface were the shift fork runs and how hot it had got

this is the fork i think has done the damage u can see that the little ball that runs in the shift drum has broken off thus causing it to mess 2 gears at once as well as the wear in it and how hot it has got

sorry for hijacking but thought it was worth it
[/b]
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go hard or go home

[morebloodymoney]

Ouch v8toy that is a real mess, Mate what year is that bike and how many hours do you think you put on it , mine knocked off 4 teeth off 3rd drive, you couldn't even tell there was anything wrong when ridding,only found small bits of gear teeth when doing oil change

[v8toy]

thats an 07 model year bought mid last year new, its only done about 6 races and practise days and about 20hrs of bush/trail riding

from day one it had the so called gearbox whine on decel but as soon as the factory oil was changed to motorex fully synthetic 1w40 didnt make it again.

first i had a prob with it jumping outa 4th at the last race then by the last moto it had no 4th at all then as i landed of a small ski jump (like 2ft of air) the gearbox locked up and skidded to a hault.

with this case what i reckon happened is it broke the little ball of the shift fork which let that particular gear to slide to the wrong spot causing a chain reaction.
What prob didnt help is that i was stuck on a corner and couldnt push it of the track so i just give it fistfull and let the clutch out and made it drive just to get of the track.

thats the only damage apart from obvious oil pump wear the cases and everything else is still fine
the parts list should consist of,

Almost a full gear set (no shafts needed but am considering it)
shift drum
3 shift forks
various circlips and washers for gear set and other items in clutch cover
full gasket set
piston and rings (just cause i can)
both oil pumps to be rebuilt or new ones

the bike will be sold now anyway (got 2 ktm's now) so i might as well do it right b4 it goes so some other poor soul doesnt have to worry.
Lucky im a bike mech hey otherwise labour would be a killer too
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go hard or go home

[morebloodymoney]

G'day v8toy, I'm sorry i asked what year it was i read your post above and you said there it was a 07, I'll say your lucky also to be a bike mechanic in more ways than one not just on saving some coin but also knowing your gonna do it right.

Seeing your a bike machanic mate i might pick your brain if you don't mind i just wanna know how many tranny failures you see, i mean on quads. I have only known one quad transmission to fail out of all the guys i race with(besides suzuki) and it was a trx 450 06 model, and it is not stock, the guy would be what i would call a pro as well and he don't show it any mercy, and he got what i would call a very good amount of time out of it. I can understand his box blowin up as he flat shifts it all the time and if he can't find em he just jams em in.

Now this idiot(dealer) was trying to tell me mine failed after 5 hours because i installed a cherry bomb, can you imagine racing the corked up thing around the track with that stupid airbox lid with the 2 little holes and the spark arrester in it, i would say a suzuki with a cherrybomb would be on par with the other 450's hp wise, so what i want to know is are you seeing any other brands with 5 hours on them taking a dump in there gearbox. Before i bought mine i knew suzuki was having trouble with the dreaded whine (like you mentioned with yours) and the shift pin syndrome, but heard they are improving ther 08 trannys.

When i ordered the bike i asked the dealer are they having trouble with the 08 transmissions (like the toss would tell me anyway)he replied no not like the yamaha's are( thats when i should have walked out of the shop. I should have clicked then this guy is a w#nker) the only other dealer in that town is a yamaha dealer. I then told him my banshee is nearly 2 years old and i havn't had a single problem, and my sons yz 250 is the same age and not one drama, he then replied were always fixing yamaha's transmissions, so v8toy are you seeing this as you are a bike mechanic or are you hearing this at races ?

Those ktm's are a trick lookin bit of gear hey, i'd love an orange elephant, a guy i race with has a polaris 525(ktm) and it sounds awsome , haven't seen a ktm in person yet but they look pretty good , haven't heard any bad reports either.

[Huskygoat]

Nope I'm not saying anything nothing my lips are sealed loose lips sink battleships going home now turning the computer off get what I mean quick ring suzuki and pay him before he spills his guts all over the forum hurry

Huskygoat